Refreshing the engine (rebuild and aftermath)

Well, I have decided that the strange engine noises within the motor finally warrant a tear down. I am going to an engine builder to take care of the long block so my questions concern the rest of the engine. This van has never had overheating issues, so I am going to risk just flushing the radiator out really well and replacing every coolant line. I also am going to do the rear heater delete to save some headaches in the future. So here is what I am replacing:

radiator Hoses
coolant and vac lines
water pump
thermostat
alternator/power steering/AC belts
motor and transmission mounts
air/fuel/oil filters
spark plugs and wires
clutch kit
resurfacing the flywheel
alternator

Now my question is, what am I missing? I have combed thru a few of others users rebuild blogs/threads and I don't think I have overlooked anything. Or if anyone has any recommendations of stuff that should be done while the motor is out.

http://i.imgur.com/NPcp26R.jpg?1

Distributor cap and rotor.
Power steering pump pressure and return lines.
Rear differential oil.
Transmission oil.
Transmission input and output seals.
Rear Main Seal.
Power steering pump. (If it whines and leaks)
Radiator cap.
Fan clutch.

I'm assuming you read my ENGINE OVERHAUL thread......That one outlines all the usual things (including rear heater delete). I put part numbers and links throughout that thread. Tim

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Originally Posted by Rufus

Distributor cap and rotor.
Power steering pump pressure and return lines.
Rear differential oil.
Transmission oil.
Transmission input and output seals.
Rear Main Seal.
Power steering pump. (If it whines and leaks)
Radiator cap.
Fan clutch.

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Thanks for the suggestions.

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Originally Posted by timsrv

I'm assuming you read my ENGINE OVERHAUL thread......That one outlines all the usual things (including rear heater delete). I put part numbers and links throughout that thread. Tim

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I did! It is a very helpful resource.




*Edit: found the part I was looking for..

New parts are starting to roll in and in the mean time I am trying to fix all the little things. But this poor van is such a turd. Somehow the previous owner sheered off the transmission fill plug and it had to be JB welded back into it. Here it is screwed all the way in:

http://i.imgur.com/0KYit0u.jpg



And who knows how I am going to get this intake cleaned out. The entire lower and upper intake manifolds were covered in this black sludge that doesn't exactly just rinse out.


http://i.imgur.com/2D057hX.jpg

You should look for a fire damage restoration company in your area that has a large ultrasonic cleaner. I had one ultrasonic ally clean all of my metal engine parts for my airplane. There is no chemicals (they use water), there is no loss of parent material (no sand blasting), and the parts came out spotless. I paid about $200 to have the crankcase halves, carburetor parts, cylinders, accessory cover, and a few other parts done. Great deal. It removes paint and everything. Even from the impossible to reach areas.

I would also recommend having your injectors (especially the cold start injector) cleaned & tested. That residue looks suspiciously like the result of a leaky cold start injector. Tim

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Originally Posted by timsrv

I would also recommend having your injectors (especially the cold start injector) cleaned & tested. That residue looks suspiciously like the result of a leaky cold start injector. Tim

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I am going to just upgrade the injectors the the 4 port jams.

I finally got my motor back this week. Apparently the camshaft was shot so a new one had to be ordered and that was what was causing the "hold up". Anyway, it's all pretty and new looking:


http://i.imgur.com/itGfSdj.jpg


And here it is before it went into the van. It's all bolted up in the van currently, still need to bolt up the transmission, fill fluids and all the other little things. Should be done next week!


http://i.imgur.com/FsqQR2F.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/PKxkoPz.jpg

She's a beauty!

I see the upper half of the intake is already "installed". Is it just temporarily sitting there, or actually bolted down? If bolted, how do you plan on hooking up injector connections? Did you make a removable injector harness? Tim

PS: Very nice looking engine! I like these type projects :thmbup:.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by timsrv

I see the upper half of the intake is already "installed". Is it just temporarily sitting there, or actually bolted down? If bolted, how do you plan on hooking up injector connections? Did you make a removable injector harness? Tim

PS: Very nice looking engine! I like these type projects :thmbup:.

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I took inspiration from your injector harness and made one for my van. I'll take a better picture of it when I get out there and finish the install.

I was wondering about that. Very cool! :thmbup:. When I build an engine I want it completed BEFORE installation. The removable harness connection here also serves to electrically access all injectors in the event of future troubleshooting. I have already used this once while I was troubleshooting a clogged injector (due to contamination in my fuel system). It was nice taking the guess work out of the troubleshooting. I mapped all injector pin locations prior to installing so I know where each pin on each injector is from my remote harness connectors :yes:. Tim

Sweet! Too nice to hide under the van. You need to make clear Lexan engine covers and keep pass. seat out!:thmbup:. Out of curiosity how much are you into it for? I'm looking at doing something like that after I'm done with the chassis:doh:

Awesome! I wish I had the space to pull the motor and send it out to rebuild. Would have saved me some $$$. What clutch kit did you go with?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by timsrv

I was wondering about that. Very cool! :thmbup:. When I build an engine I want it completed BEFORE installation. The removable harness connection here also serves to electrically access all injectors in the event of future troubleshooting. I have already used this once while I was troubleshooting a clogged injector (due to contamination in my fuel system). It was nice taking the guess work out of the troubleshooting. I mapped all injector pin locations prior to installing so I know where each pin on each injector is from my remote harness connectors :yes:. Tim

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Yea, I wanted to completely assymble the motor before it went in so the harness was not an option for me. It was pretty simple, used a cheap 8 pin connector and my new injectors came with new plugs so I needed to replace them anyway.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Carbonized

Sweet! Too nice to hide under the van. You need to make clear Lexan engine covers and keep pass. seat out!:thmbup:. Out of curiosity how much are you into it for? I'm looking at doing something like that after I'm done with the chassis:doh:

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Well, it was $850 for the rebuild plus an extra $240 for a new camshaft. It took much longer than expected but I really can't complain (so far) about the work. They removed broken studs, replaced everything, gave me a gasket set and a fresh coat of paint. That with fluids, and replacement parts I have about $2000 in this project.

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Originally Posted by Ian R.

Awesome! I wish I had the space to pull the motor and send it out to rebuild. Would have saved me some $$$. What clutch kit did you go with?

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Exedy, I have used them in many other vehicles and love them.

Yes, you cannot really complain about the price. I don't know where in the US you are but here in Screwyouland $850.00 would barely cover the freeze plug and disposal fees:LOL2:. Looking at the last 2 pictures, your own elbow grease is definitely worth a "pretty penny" too! Great work, hope she runs a good as she looks for you! Yours is a lucky van!

Engine is all in and almost done. Got a timing issue or something, not starting. But something to tackle tomorrow.

http://i.imgur.com/iAR7mv9.jpg


Here is the 8 pin injector harness plug, along with one of many homemade cable straps. We figure that one of the previous owners pulled the head and just did a crap job putting it back together. Lot of missing parts and bolts.

http://i.imgur.com/1CDOoWo.jpg


Almost a van again!

http://i.imgur.com/oLuU7FV.jpg

Epic! She is a beaut!

Got it fired up finally. Ran like crap making an awful noise from the head. Sounded like a generator was running under the seat. Limped it home about 15 miles and let it sit over night. Fired it up the next morning and it ran as smooth and quite as could be. No idea what happened but it hasn't made noises in the last 40 miles I've put on it. Going to order an oil pressure and water temperature gauges just to keep an eye on things but, fingers crossed its good to go.

That's weird, perhaps some of the lifters were not initially pumping up.........or perhaps they were pumped up too much??? Did you put them in dry or did you fill then with oil before installing?

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Originally Posted by timsrv

That's weird, perhaps some of the lifters were not initially pumping up.........or perhaps they were pumped up too much??? Did you put them in dry or did you fill then with oil before installing?

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I didn't do the rebuild, had an engine shop perform that bit. But 117 miles on it so far and no more issues yet.

Spoke too soon. The red "oil" light on the dash lights up after after driving for 15-20 mins and then goes off and on. I have both a low oil pressure and low oil light sensor on my van, but I only have a the one red oil light on the dash. So I am not 100% certain what it is in reference too. I ordered an oil pressure gauge and water temp gauge so I'll know for sure what is going on when that all comes in. Got inspection done today too and it started leaking coolant from around the intake. I cannot see where it is originating from but it comes through the little hole on the bottom of the intake and runs down from there (this was taken on the underside of the van):


http://i.imgur.com/BT28S9M.jpg

There are the coolant bypass hoses on your throttle body, hopefully it's one of those.........because the only other place is the air valve between the intake manifold halves. If the hoses on your TB are okay, then you will likely need to remove the upper half of your intake manifold to access the air valve hose. Tim

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a23...pst6qweov0.jpg

That sort of looks like that "hose of death" thing...

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Originally Posted by Suzu

That sort of looks like that "hose of death" thing...

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Yeah, it takes the same hose here too. The hose in this location is fairly well sheltered and seems to hold up well. I've never had one of these leak (yet), but I always replace these when I have the manifold apart. I also use the Toyota hose and the factory spring clamps here. I used to think the factory spring clamps were junk, but experience has taught me otherwise (there's an advantage to OE clamps). As the hoses get hotter/softer and the metal expands/contracts, and the hoses slowly give way to the external/internal forces, the spring clamps self adjust (always exerting a slight tightening pressure on the hose). It's this constant pressure that makes them superior. The stainless screw clamps seal initially, but as things heat, cool, settle, and slowly degrade due to external & internal forces, they do not self adjust and this leads to leaks. Not a big deal to re-adjust them when there's access, but a very big deal when there's not.

The down side to the stock spring clamps is you'll need to use the Toyota 8 mm ID heater hose. Standard 5/16" ID heater hose is identical (regarding ID), but the OD varies depending on what brand of hose you get. Since the spring clamps will only work correctly with a specific size & wall thickness, it just makes sense to stick with OE hose. Even though I happen to believe the Gates heater hose is better quality, the wall thickness prevents the spring clamps from working properly. You could probably get aftermarket spring clamps for the Gates hose, but why reinvent the wheel? Tim

A few of the OEM hoses are not available anymore unfortunately. I'm using silicon hose for most of what I couldn't get through Toyota.

That particular hose & the hose of death are not available in OE anymore, but Toyota does sell this same hose in bulk. The OE HOD actually did have a slight bend formed into it, but it was so slight, the bulk hose has absolutely no problem conforming. You can buy in pre-cut lengths, but I usually buy in 300 mm (about 1') and cut to size. It's Toyota part number 99556-10300 (the 300 on the end is length). And yes, being OE it's ridiculously expensive ($8.53, ~71¢ per inch), but it's worth it to me for the piece of mind...........especially in those hard to access areas.

BTW, this hose is also available in 200 mm lengths (about 8") Toyota part number 99556-10200. Price works out about the same per inch, but I've found the 200 mm piece just slightly too short to make into 2 hoses of death. If you buy the 300 mm piece, you can get 2 HODs out of it (less waste). If you purchase from one of those on-line Toyota parts sites, you can save ~30% on price, but the shipping will usually make up the difference. Tim

Fixed the coolant leak awhile ago and forgot to update. It was the exact hose you pictured. There was a screw left in the intake manifold that was backed out just far enough to rub a pin hole in that hose. No idea why the screw was there but it was.

I have also installed a coolant temp and oil pressure gauge. Shortly after warm up the van gets to 240* F and stays there. Which is about the position it is on my van's gauge (even though there's no temperature values marked). My guess is that that old radiator needs to be replaced. I hoped a good flush would have fixed it but, not this time. Oil pressure seems fine, around 20 psi idle and 60 - 40 psi while driving. But those darn lifters are still so noisy even after about 1000 miles on this new motor. They do quiet after 30 minutes of driving but that is just not acceptable for a rebuilt motor.

240° F is way, way too hot.........especially for a new motor. I personally would never run one of these above 230°. I will run them up to 230° but only very occasionally (like climbing a hill or something) but only for short spurts. As a general rule, you want to keep it below 220°. There's a few good threads here that will help you sort out your cooling system issues. Here's a recent one with links to some other good ones. Tim

http://www.toyotavantech.com/forum/s...erheating-duh)

After letting this thing sit for awhile I finally tore it open to see where that damn noise was coming from. Not to my surprise 3 lifters are really bad and one moves just barely. I am going to attempt to pull them without pulling the head but I'm afraid that may not happen.

https://youtu.be/FLhAgjeWyK0

They make a lifter puller tool that will go down inside there. If you pull the spark plugs and the spark plug tubes this helps immensely with access.

Lifters came out easy. I got 8 new Meller lifters from autozone and put them in today. The toyota van fsm said to soak them in diesel fuel before installation but I just primed them in a cup of oil before hand. Getting the rocker arms and push rods all in together was a real aggravation. I ended up zip-tieing the rocker arms together in pairs in order to keep everything aligned. Then I fired it up and... sounds just as bad as it did before, loud clattering, and it bogs down at idle. I have no idea where to go from here.

https://youtu.be/DWO_QsNYRcQ

Have you checked actual cam lift? Maybe you have some flat lobes. I'm not positive of the oiling circuits on these but the fact that all the loose rockers are together would make me wonder if you spun a cam bearing.

Flat camshaft? Check travel with a dial indicator. Also, make sure the rocker shaft is right side up.

http://www.toyotavantech.com/forum/s...roubleshooting

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Originally Posted by timsrv

Flat camshaft? Check travel with a dial indicator. Also, make sure the rocker shaft is right side up.

http://www.toyotavantech.com/forum/s...roubleshooting

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Camshaft was replaced when the motor was rebuilt supposedly. Rocker shaft is correct, it was what I thought the problem was originally.

Thanks for the recommendations though guys.

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Originally Posted by terrence

it was what I thought the problem was originally.

Thanks for the recommendations though guys.

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So you were able to correct the problem? What was it?

Kinda, not really though. It was way out of time, fixed that. But there is still a lot of noise, my pops seems to think it's just old and that's how it sounds. Are 4ys normally noisy?

Noise like that is caused from excessive play in your valve train. These parts will wear very quickly if you don't correct it. Something has thrown off your valve geometry. If you're sure the cam is okay, you have good oil pressure, the correct parts were used, and assembly is correct, then it could have been a machining error. If it's a machining error this can be corrected by getting custom push rods.

I haven't run into this issue in years, but way, way back in the old days, on some of the old-school engines (with non-adjustable valves) we could order push rods in different lengths as it was the only way to adjust valves. Some auto manufacturers used to offer them in different lengths too. If we had a noisy valve train, and a push rod was too short, we'd put a longer one in. I don't think Toyota ever offered this, but there are some specialty shops you can go and get these made. Here's one: http://www.pushrods.net/pushrods.html (I'm sure there's more). Of course before they could help you would need to take & record precise measurements so they would know the length to make them. Basically you position the cam so the lifter is on the base of the lobe, then measure the free travel between the rocker and the push-rod. Since you want the lifter to operate @ approx 1/2 of it's internal travel, you'd add .09" (full internal travel of our lifters is about .180"). Take the number you come up with (play + .09") then write "+.xxx" on a piece of tape and attach to the push rod. You should then write down the full desired length (push rod + play + .09") on a sheet of paper and make a note of which position in the engine it goes (this will be very important when installing the new custom push rods). Repeat this with the other 7 push rods. If you run into one with no free play you could skip it (probably okay), but I would rather get a complete custom set. Measuring is a little more complicated if there is no free play, but there are ways to do it. By the sound of that video, I'm guessing all your push rods are too short. Once you have all your numbers recorded, send you push-rods into the shop and they'll change the length or make you a new set.

For more information about the 4y valve train, ready my blog: http://www.toyotavantech.com/forum/e...ebuild-part-13. Tim

I checked after letting the motor run a bit and the lifters seem to be doing their job.
The rock arm assembly thing is on and in the correct position.
Push arm's are straight, but no idea about correct length's.
I have an oil pressure gauge hooked up and its reading anywhere between 40 and 60 psi.

So let's assume that the cam the engine builder got was wrong or defective; how would I even go about checking that without pulling the motor? And by "free-play" do are you referring to when there is no tension on the push rod and it can be moved by hand or something?