funky smell under load

[Burntboot]

I have been getting a metallic smell while climbing big hills, it can and will accelerate up steep hills on the highway in 5th at any speed over 80KPH
but the longer the hill the more it smells.
Lately, I've noticed the same odour while cruising on the highway but much less prominent, it is only evident with the windows down (summer driving) so I don't really know if it has always done that or not (winters here are very cold and the heater really sucks)

This has been a long standing issue that hasn't been corrected by any of the other repairs.
To date (working backwards)- timing chain & gears, tps and full throttlebody cleaning, O2 sensors (both), cat, cap, rotor, wires, plugs and a pile of other stuff I am probably forgetting, like fusible links, air filter, various grounds.....

The only code it ever throws is 12 (no "NE" (rpm) signal to ecu after 2 secs of engine has been cranked)
I do have the dreaded intermittent no start (click, click, click), it will eventually start by rocking the clutch pedal till it starts to crank.
Usually though by the time it does, it has pumped enough gas through so it cranks a long time and takes a moment to clear it's throat.
I only ever see that code after one or more of these incidents.
Many things have been done to alleviate that condition, but none have had any lasting joy.
I have assumed that that is the source of my code 12 but just to verify I did pull the ecu and follow the diagnostic.
I do indeed have voltage (0.84) between IGT and E1, (spec is >7-1.0V) and it passes all the other tests on page FI-33.

I am guessing I am running a bit rich under load or suffering from insufficient advance.
Back before the timing chain was replaced, I had to crank the timing to 16deg to pass emission and I thought the smell seemed a bit less.
Once the chain went in I set it back to 12deg and have been smelling it ever since (but only on long hills)
(the timing does jump to 20deg when the jumper is pulled so I assume the timing is advancing correctly)

Aside form the smell, it runs like a top and the mileage is decent, I am averaging about 10.5L/100km (23mpg US) in mixed driving and I rarely do less than 120K (70mph) on the highway so I consider that to be fair consumption.

The only other suspect issue I can find is that the engine seems to run a tad cool (just left of centre - the needle just touches the edge of the wiggly water line and rarely goes higher) it does have new stat, water pump all hoses and a recored rad and the coolant has been flushed twice and is filled with Toyota Red.
I did notice it is missing the lower shroud so by rights it should run a little warm, clutch fan quiets down after a few seconds and I don't believe I hear it when it is hot, so I suspect it is functioning fine and not causing over cooling issues.

What I don't know is if the running temperature is enough to make it run rich or not??
I do have a slight carbon buildup in the tail pipe but just enough to mark you finger with a wipe, so it isn't a heavy deposit and it doesn't blow smoke.

I suppose there is a small possibility that it is distributor related as when I got Red, it really didn't like wet weather.
I found the dist cap was held on by 1 screw, which of course broke as soon as I touched it, the other 2 were already snapped off.
I did pull the dist. and clean it all up and drill and rethread the mounting holes and all seemed okay, but I suppose I may have missed cleaning a connection or 2, I don't remember if I cleaned up the electrical connections in there or not?? but as it ran well I haven't gone back there.
It was also missing an O2 sensor and the cat was toast, so while all the repairs have produced improvements, I have no baseline to compare to.

It is NOT insured for fire loss so that isn't an option.

I really need to solve this as I like driving with the windows down, and I am sure it isn't good for it in the longterm.

If anyone has any ideas I am all ears.

Thanks
BB

[Burntboot]

So, I ran through every pin test at the ECU and everything came back normal.

In a fit of desperation, I decided to check the coolant sensor for the EFI and at first it read perfectly, then it didn't, then it thought it was -40C, then it was fine, then it wasn't.
Argh.

Might have been nice if it had flagged a code, but nooooooo.

New sensor is on order, will report back once it is swapped out.

BB

[llamavan]

Your van's temperature may be perfectly OK — that's exactly where my '89 DLX 4WD sits.

You don't mention oil consumption (or lack thereof).

Gwen

[Burntboot]

Hey Gwen

Good thought on oil consumption but unfortunately it is well within spec, currently about 1L/5000km.

The temp gauge used to run bang on the middle of the gauge, but during one of the many repairs, I removed the leaky block heater at #4 cylinder and installed a proper frost plug, ever since then, it has been a tad on the cool side.

Really hoping a new CTS puts paid to this issue, a "cheap" fix would be a nice change.

BB

[llamavan]

Given that a leaky part put the operating temp lower, I'd lean towards the lower reading being "proper" for your van, but if in doubt, t-stats are cheap to replace (that is, as long as you do it right and also get the Toyota parts, not trouble-causing aftermarket stuff). Your "heater sucks" remark is another vote for a new t-stat.

It's tough to diagnose by smell, especially when descriptions (let alone perceptions) of smells differ between people. However, "metallic" says "too hot" to me rather than "not hot enough" ... FWIW.

Condition and level of tranny and diff oil (especially tranny)?

Gwen

[Burntboot]

The block heater wasn't an active leak but there was a tracer down the block, I never had to top up the coolant.
T-stat is only a year old and is OEM, as is virtually every other part, right down to wiper blades and battery.
The convertor, some of the heater hoses, timing cover gasket and radio are A/M, and the tranny/TF were rebuilt less than a year ago and have had one fluid change since.
The heater output has always been non-existent on anything other than defrost, I expect to know more when I go dash diving as I still have to overhaul the clutch and brake masters, replace the windscreen and instrument cluster and a few other things while I am in there.

I didn't expect anyone to be able to diagnose a smell over the internet, rather, I was hoping that someone has had a similar experience and could share some wisdom.

For the record, I think what I am smelling is the catalytic convertor running outside of it's happy zone.
I will know better by wednesday after the CTS is replaced.
BB

[Burntboot]

Finally got the new sensor installed and took it for an 800km test drive.
No change, what so ever.

Back to the drawing board.

[MonTex]

I recently installed a new California-spec, stainless-steel encased, Magnaflow CAT. As its newness was 'baking off', I had quite the *metallic* smell for a week or so. Now, my SS CAT is brown. This is likely normal for SS, given that the SS grate on my BBQ grill has changed from shiny SS to brown also. :wnk:

[Burntboot]

+1 for Gwen
I originally ignored the obvious T-stat symptoms as I had already replaced it with OEM and it was under 2 yrs old.

As I had one on hand and was out of other ideas I decided to swap it in, just to eliminate all the variables.
It ran in the driveway for over an hour and I was convinced I had wasted my time.

But once on the road, it hunted a little, then settled into a higher position on the gauge, now truly JUST left of centre.
In retrospect, the old one ran closer to 1/4 of the gauge.
Smell is mostly gone and mileage is back to around 11L/100km, up from 13L or so.
BB

[Burntboot]

On another thread MonTex had linked to some info on fan clutches. I read it and filed it away in the back of my brain.
While going through some used parts I bought, I came across 2 clutch fans,both used but one looks nearly new.
Held it for a moment trying to figure out why it seemed different.
Then it donned on me, on the truck it has a blue pulley and these are both red??
Had occasion to dig a little deeper the other day.

For what it's worth, you can change the clutch fan on a 4wd without pulling the pass seat.'
You do have to pull the pwr str idler with bracket, engine hook and the pwr str pump pulley and hold your nose just so, but it is doable.

Not only does my "original" have a blue pulley but also deep fan blades, way more pitch than the "spares".
The "spares" look the same as the picture in my manual.
Put on the good looking one and went for a little test drive.

The engine temperature builds a LOT faster and once the clutch has disengaged, you can actually see it turning slower than engine speed.
There is an obvious difference in the amount of air the fan moves.
There seems to be a significant increase in power as well, hills that used to require a downshift to 4th, no longer do.
While my running temperature is still on the cool side what I consider normal, there is more heat in the heater.
Detected no odd smells, either, though that may have as much to do with body repairs as anything else.

I do know the fan clutch was replaced previously, I can only assume that the garage decided to try to eliminate some other issues at the same time.
BB

[timsrv]

Stuck clutch fans can steal a lot of power and greatly decrease fuel economy. Due to the age and importance of these "when in doubt change it out". A while back I posted a video on how to test these. Here's a link: http://www.toyotavantech.com/forum/showthread.php?693-An-unorthodox-method-for-testing-the-clutch-fan

[Burntboot]

808
Hey Tim - The old fan was fine, as far as all the tests go I just thought it pushed a awful lot of air.
(I also noticed the fan in your video has the red pulley)

It was only when I found the spares that it all came together in my brain.
The one on the right of the pic is the suspected H/D unit, the one on the left is happily living on the front of my engine now.
I remember several work orders where the PO complained of coolant lights and engine temps.... and nothing after the WO for the fan clutch.

Up until MT's post, I was unaware of the possibility of a H/D offering, I suspect they installed it to alleviate other issues they had caused.

It is nice to see the engine temperature start to move after only a couple of km's of driving (vs 15-20) to actually have enough heat that I don't get frostbite and to have a little more power to boot.
I was amazed at how much difference there was.