Fuel Damper question.

[xman808]

What's the drawback if you bypass it? Mine leaks a very, very tiny amount, maybe a drop or two before start up.

[timsrv]

It's job is to even out the pulsations created by the fuel pump. Toyota probably wouldn't have put one there if it wasn't needed. Can you seriously not afford a new one? I know genuine Toyota is expensive, but aftermarket can be had for around $40. I've purchased a couple off of www.rockauto.com & they seem to be pretty solid. Don't take any chances when it comes to fuel leaks. If it leaks, even if it's just a little bit, don't drive it until it's fixed. Leaky pulsation dampers have been responsible for several van fires. Please don't add yours to that list. Tim

[xman808]

Thanks, just was wondering what would happen if I bypass it for now.

Is the difference between these just the price?
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a23/timsrv/TVT%20pics/Fuel%20system/rockautopulsationdampers_zps2b73f7f6.png

[timsrv]

I'm not sure about the others on the above list, but the Standard Motor Products FPD3 & FPD4 are different only in what pressures they are designed to operate at (FPD3 = Fuel Pulsation Damper 30 PSI & FPD4 = Fuel Pulsation Damper 40 PSI. 84 - 87 vans originally came with lower pressure fuel regulators, so if your van is pre 88 and you don't want to replace the FPR (fuel pressure regulator) then go with the FPD3. Personally I run the higher Pressure 88 - 89 FPR's on all my vans (as it helps reduce the "heat soak" (http://www.toyotavantech.com/forum/content.php?218-The-infamous-hot-soak) issue). If you're running the higher PSI FPR, then you should also be running the higher PSI FPD (PFD4). I have only purchased & used the FPD4 & not experienced any problems. I have noticed however the threads (12m X 1.25) are a bit rough, so I always run a die over the threads before installation (helps them to thread on easier).

I suspect the van will run okay without the pulsation damper. I haven't heard Toyota's "official" explanation on why it's there, but I have knowledge of similar systems. Typically pumps create pulsations. Injectors firing (on/off/on........) will do the same. These pulsation can create a "hammering" effect on the other components in the system. Over time this "shock" or stress can lead to premature failure. The pulsation damper is a small reservoir with a rubber diaphragm inside. A spring is placed on the "vent" side to counteract the forces on the "pressure" side. When fuel enters the chamber the pressure slightly inflates the diaphragm & compresses the spring. Now the pulsations, instead of pounding away at the other components, simply flex the diaphragm & spring. So essentially the diaphragm inside the damper vibrates at a frequency to counter act the pulsations. Another way to put it is: It reduces the stress on other components & equalizes pressure variations by "dampening pulsations" :wnk:. Tim

[Don Kihote]

I'm not sure about the others on the above list, but the Standard Motor Products FPD3 & FPD4 are different only in what pressures they are designed to operate at (FPD3 = Fuel Pulsation Damper 30 PSI & FPD4 = Fuel Pulsation Damper 40 PSI. 84 - 87 vans originally came with lower pressure fuel regulators, so if your van is pre 88 and you don't want to replace the FPR (fuel pressure regulator) then go with the FPD3. Personally I run the higher Pressure 88 - 89 FPR's on all my vans (as it helps reduce the "heat soak" (http://www.toyotavantech.com/forum/content.php?218-The-infamous-hot-soak) issue). If you're running the higher PSI FPR, then you should also be running the higher PSI FPD (PFD4). I have only purchased & used the FPD4 & not experienced any problems. I have noticed however the threads (12m X 1.25) are a bit rough, so I always run a die over the threads before installation (helps them to thread on easier).

I suspect the van will run okay without the pulsation damper. I haven't heard Toyota's "official" explanation on why it's there, but I have knowledge of similar systems. Typically pumps create pulsations. Injectors firing (on/off/on........) will do the same. These pulsation can create a "hammering" effect on the other components in the system. Over time this "shock" or stress can lead to premature failure. The pulsation damper is a small reservoir with a rubber diaphragm inside. A spring is placed on the "vent" side to counteract the forces on the "pressure" side. When fuel enters the chamber the pressure slightly inflates the diaphragm & compresses the spring. Now the pulsations, instead of pounding away at the other components, simply flex the diaphragm & spring. So essentially the diaphragm inside the damper vibrates at a frequency to counter act the pulsations. Another way to put it is: It reduces the stress on other components & equalizes pressure variations by "dampening pulsations" :wnk:. Tim

Dear All, I have some pictures about damper:

1030 1031 1031 1032 1033 10341035 1036

These pictures made by Mr. ToyotaVan85 - an owner's Van 1985, he love his car very much. I am his friend!!

[timsrv]

Nice pics. Thanks for sharing. :thmbup: More information on he FPD HERE (http://www.toyotavantech.com/forum/showthread.php?1441-leaky-fuel-line-to-rail-what-does-this-thing-do)

[trestlehed]

Tim,

Gonna replace the FPD on my van.
So the question is: Do you think it's ok to go aftermarket with this?

The one from Toyota is about $155 plus tax & shipping.

Rock Auto sounds like a good deal... But don't wanna have to do it twice (or have to use
a fire extinguisher!)

How is/are your aftermarket FPD's holding up?

Thanks!

[timsrv]

I'm currently running these aftermarket ones on 2 of my vans & have installed one on another person's van. I recently purchased a couple more for my parts inventory. The 1st one I installed was about 2 years ago & so far there's been no issues. For parts like this I don't think Toyota has a monopoly on quality. I feel comfortable with this aftermarket part & would no longer consider paying 5X the price for Toyota. Just my .02 cents.

If/when I ever have an issue I'll update here immediately. So far so good :yes:. Tim

[trestlehed]

OK Tim, I'll go with aftermarket with your blessing.
Thanks again!

[MyToy]

I removed my fuel damper and re-installing it. The washers that came with it are suspect. Somebody mentioned you could use regular crush washers but It looks like the fuel needs passage past the washer. Can a regurlar crush washer work? Not sure where I would find the original.

[timsrv]

You are correct. Unless you cut some reliefs on the inside edge, that washer will not work. You need Toyota part #23232-28010 (https://www.toyotapartsdeal.com/oem/toyota~gasket~for~pulsation~damper~hose~23232-28010.html) for the damper side and Toyota part #90430-12005 (https://www.toyotapartsdeal.com/oem/toyota~gasket~for~turbo~oil~inlet~pipe~90430-12005.html) for the rail side. I've never looked for or used any aftermarket ones, but for many years Toyota used these washers on almost everything they built, so I'd be surprised if aftermarket ones weren't out there and readily available. Tim

[MyToy]

Thanks buddy. I will find a set somewhere.

MT

[MyToy]

Hey Tim:

Got my new washers for the damper but found after installatioin a tiny fuel leak on the top side of the banjo fitting. It is very small meaning that if I trigger the fuel pump on I have to wait a minute or so where you can see a slight discoloration at the top of the banjo fitting where a tiny amount of fuel is leaking out. In fact even having it on for a while never produced enough to make a drop. I snugged up the damper bit by bit but still could not stop it. Any suggestions?

MT

[timsrv]

Check very closely to be sure it's coming from a washer surface. Then take it back apart and check the mating surfaces. If there's a problem, you may need to replace something. If it's the banjo, you may be able to compensate by double washering it, but it would be better to remove the steel line and have a machine shop clean it up. If you end up double washering the big side, you'll need to be sure the relieved areas of the washers line up to allow flow.

FWIW, I haven't been very impressed with the machine quality of the Standard FPD's (but so far it's only been the threads). If the threaded shaft of the FPD is not exactly 90° to the rest of it, that could also cause a leak. Tim

PS: If you are using an old FPD, keep in mind these don't last forever. They can develop leaks over time and have been the reason for multiple van engine fires. If it's old and you don't know when it was replaced last, it's better to just replace.

[MyToy]

Thanks Tim.

I replaced Fuel Damper about 30K ago. Like I said, it did the same thing then. But some additional tightening it stopped. Do you think there is any chance the surface of the injector line it screws in to can also have a blemishes? I would hate to have to take the manifold off again to pull that.
Why would doubling up on the washers improve this? The leak is so small I cannot tell if the leak is from the top or bottom side of the crush washer that mates to the injector line.

[MyToy]

Tim, one more thing. you sent me two washers to use a 23232-28010 and a 90430-12005. The damper uses two 28010's, one on top and one on the bottom. Where does the 12005 go?

MT

[timsrv]

Can you tell what side it's leaking from (fuel rail side or FPD side)? If it's leaking from the fuel rail side, then yeah, it could be a blemish on the rail. The rail is aluminum, so if it's overtightened, it can strip out (I had that happen once and it was a PITA). If you can identify position of leak, double washering would only be done on the surface that's leaking and it's somewhat of a bandaid fix. It can work because there is more material to crush to compensate for imperfections. But keep in mind it also leaves a couple less threads to grab into the fuel rail, which makes it slightly more likely to strip...especially if you're overtightening. And take it from me, even if you have an extra one laying around, the disassembly that's required to replace the fuel rail makes it a PITA :bdmd:. Tim

The -12005 is used between the rail and the banjo, the -28010 (with the relieved inside edge) is used between the banjo and the FPD. Using the -28010 on the rail side could be causing your problem.

[MyToy]

Wow!. When I had the engine overhauled and removed the FPD they used two of the 20810's on both top and bottom.
So this 12005 goes on top against the fuel rail??????

Ok, just ordered 10, they come 10 in a bag.

Oh Brother, I will never get this done.

Thanks buddy

[Jtbechtold]

It's not going to cause any issues, a lot of cars don't even have them.

[MyToy]

Hey everyone. As I have reported in past threads I had this issue with the washers supplied with the damper. That is the problem. Tim steered me to the correct Toyota washers where there are two different ones. One for the top and one for the bottom. The one that comes with the damper was 2 bottom ones, which I used before and had a hell of a time. So I ordered in the correct ones and it turns out the top one is copper not aluminum . Here are the pics. Leak stopped right away with the copper on installed. You can see the difference when I laid them over each other.

[Headhunter38]

If you still have the original copper washer you can anneal them with a propane torch and then sand them flat. I just recently did that for my mr2's FPD washer cause I couldn't get it to seal. My mr2 uses them same washer for the FPD.